Nader Thoughts



  • SzakalotSzakalot Posts: 3,197

    Its a matter of design/gameplay decision, not what 'makes sense'. A merc with a red-alert style tesla turret would be fun to use for sure!

    Are you saying nader is overpowered? why? cause she can spam a few nades?

    Nader would be simply unviable if her nades did not deal direct damage, you would need at least twice as fast rate of fire, for her to retain any kind of usefulness, as most players know how to move away from red flashy eggz of deathz

  • GregHouseMDGregHouseMD Posts: 366
    edited May 2015
    Well, that's ironic, coming from you. I mean, you seem to be under the impression that explosives are overpowered by default. Oddly enough missing the fact that there's a merc currently in the game whose destructive potential is far higher than Nader's.

    Nevermind that, though. Discussion's been thoroughly derailed, and I think that's my cue to leave.

    EDIT: It appears Nader has been buffed already. I'm not sure. I died to Martyrdom just now - after gibbing an opponent. If the grenade sticks around now, awesome!
    Post edited by GregHouseMD on
  • LumiLumi Posts: 1,092
    the grenade vanishing after gibbing has always been a bug and not intended. They increased martyrdom grenade fuse by 0.2 seconds though.


    I don't mind the grenades exploding o ninpact, but right now it happens at a very close range. Ends up being the same as a shotgun. Would have prefered it remained specifically for further away. Anyway with the buff now they seem to want Nader to become more of a DPS dealing machine, rather than support for Aura station removal...

  • GregHouseMDGregHouseMD Posts: 366
    Buffs all around, it seems. More grenades ( 4 to 5 ), more HP( ?100 - 110? ).
  • ZenityZenity Posts: 438
    Longer fuse though, the fuse is already the main reason why her grenades are as frightening as a panda pup.

    Keep in mind that she is a pure assault, she gets ALL her XP from killing enemies, without actually having any serious combat prowess. Her grenades need to have a meaningful impact on the game, or else she is a dead weight.

    Regarding realistic physics, if you want realism, I would suggest that grenades drop at players' feet instead of bouncing away from them if directly hit in close combat. Right now aiming at enemies in close combat is a bad idea because of the bounce, if grenades would stay put instead, this would become a bit more interesting.

    The update is looking pretty good so far, I'll try her out again and see how it goes.
  • GregHouseMDGregHouseMD Posts: 366
    I don't know, longer fuse seems good. It means martyrdom because more useful as area denial.
  • SzakalotSzakalot Posts: 3,197
    edited May 2015
    snowMonkey wrote: »
    Well, that's ironic, coming from you. I mean, you seem to be under the impression that explosives are overpowered by default.

    Thank you for the 'seem' as I definitely do not think that. Indeed, fragger's nades have been OP for a while, and Ive stated that since their change, back in November I believe. Fortunately the present fly-speed nerf should put it in the right spot.
    EDIT: It appears Nader has been buffed already. I'm not sure. I died to Martyrdom just now - after gibbing an opponent. If the grenade sticks around now, awesome!

    here is the rundown of the recent changes to nader:
    Increased health to 110hp (from 100)

    This is to help her better fulfill her role of clearing out defensive positions which often requires her to expose herself to incoming fire

    Reduced movement speed by ~2.5%

    Matching / compensating for the slight increase in health

    Increased maximum Grenade Launcher Nade count to 5 (from 4) and reduced cooldown time per Nade to 7s (from 8)

    These changes are to partially compensate for the two below, but also makes her a little more effective at clearing out defences

    Reduced velocity of grenade launcher projectiles by ~30%

    Grenade Launcher 'Nades maintain a similar trajectory but now travel slower, giving victims a little more time to react

    Increased grenade launcher grenade fuse time to 1.7s (from 1.4s)

    This is to compensate for the slower travel time, still giving them a similar overall range

    Martyrdom can no-longer be cancelled by gibbing Nader before it detonates

    Previously Martyrdom became largely useless at close range and was not immediately obvious or easily explained

    Martyrdom detonation time increased to 0.9s (from 0.7s)

    To give players a little more time to escape since they can no longer cancel it by gibbing Nader

    I havent played the patch yet, my impressions are:
    - it will be easier for new players to use Nader against other new players (more nades, shorter cooldown - more nade spam)
    - Nader will be much harder to use against good players (slower fly speed, even longer fuse)
    - Nader got pushed more towards the AoE denial, rather than direct combat nades-to-the-facezz merc
    - martyrdom got buffed overall (you cant try to gib with the knife anymore, but it will be easier to get away from downed naders - overall this change will make martyrdom more useful, esp. against better players (it was pretty useless against most good players))

  • GregHouseMDGregHouseMD Posts: 366
    I wasn't referring to you. You're generally right about most things. :)
  • watsyurdealwatsyurdeal Posts: 4,766
    edited May 2015
    Seems like to me I oughta give Nader a good shake, seems like she'd be better for me than Fragger.

    He's bulky and everything sure, but I like speed, and having just enough to get around and rush the hell out of people.
    So hey, I have a small guide here you may like, go ahead, read it, you know you want to.

  • I mostly have issues with the blast radius of her grenades and the cooldown for each charge to return to her inventory. If she's dead for 20 seconds she gets back up with two grenades returned to her, and the main problem I see with this is that it means she can act nearly independently from a support providing her with ammo.

    Were it up to me, I'd probably keep the number of charges she has for her grenades and increase the cooldown to around 15 seconds or so, then taper down the damage from each grenade a bit. That way she could still be effective at carpet bombing and even do a little light harassment with indirect grenade lobbing, but she won't be a character that just runs about and can pop groups of people with a single nade every ten seconds.
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